The Door

The Door

I'm amazed you ever played another RPG in your life after that.

-Marc Gacy

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I have to make sure this never happens to anyone else again.

David Michael Grouchy II

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I have to admitt to this...if any DM we ever had was this much of a jerk? he would have been flattened out a couple times, and we would have had a new DM.

sounds like a stock nerd they put in movies to make fun of gamers..sheesh..When our DM burned out of our D&D campaign, it fell to me to run a TFT camapign. I am happy to say we never played D&D again.

when the Old DM had a guest DM come in a run our campaign for the night...we had a guy almost as bad as the one that was just shown us. He brought his grilfriend in to play as well...By the end of the night, I had invited the fellow to play football with us the following Sunday morning.

I proceeded to explain to him, after various hits, thrown balls, and blocks, usually followed by," See why I said that couldn't happen?...or..That's what happens when a football hit you..imagine a crssbow bolt!"

His girlfriend did not enjoy watching the game, as much as she did her powermad DM, just a few days before...she broke up with him the following tuesday." ...I ran into him at the mall..this is what? 20 years later..he now is a level 70 something in World of warcraaft..." sometimes folks need reality to wake them up...sometimes they just dig further into thier hole.

-Dpod19

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On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 10:41 AM, <dpod19@...> wrote:

> I have to admitt to this...if any DM we ever had was this much of a jerk? he

> would have been flattened out a couple times, and we would have had a new

> DM.

When we were new.... and, especially, when we were kids... some of us

were kids in those days (I was 11 when Nameless bought it)... that

kind of thing went on.

Now, if nothing else, we have lots of GM advice that says, don't make

people roll to see if they trip on a rock, bust their skull open, and

die. With 20+ years of playing under our belts, we know good GMs from

bad, and even have a bit more social aptitude to know good fellow

gamers from jerks.

But yeah, I think I may have lost a character to random tripping back

in the day.

Chris Goodwin

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Subj: The Decline and Fall of Role Playing Games

I cannot say I have all the answers, nor maybe any really, but here

is one fellows take on RPG games based on my own expereinces. Its a

ramble so ignore, and I compress a lot of ideas down so bear that in

mind:

I'd start with wargames and the rise fo their popularity in the

sixites. From simple games like Risk and Stratego Tctics II and

other war games emrged. Eventually in the wish to become more

detailed and accurate, whole weeks, and floors of gymnasiums would

need to be dedicated to playing out a battle. From that heady

primoridal gamer stew of lead, paper and cardboard came the RPG. In

the 70's the only competition was Atari 2600, 5 or 6 TV channels, and

a few clunky home computers.

It was a novelty that sparked a lot of imaginations and fed something

we all wanted from watching movies and reading books: to particiapte

in a great adventure and to be the star of our own story. It took

some effort, reading rules, teaching people to play a game where

there were no winners, rolling funny dice, and learning how to

control the Risk and Reward in an interactive story with you and your

friends. With no other real competition many had hours and whole

weekends to play.

In the 80's another generation of games came out that original

players of the early games built themselves and they covered more

narrow topics with more realistic rules. In other words much like

the wargames of the sixties that took the simplicity and innovation,

then became mammoths mired in details and rules, RPG's soon followed

the same model.

Instead of a complete game with everything you needed to know in 48

to 64 pages, multiple 128+ page tomes were needed to be read,

digested, and referenced to play. Blood loss from a scratch from a

Xixthar would have to be consulted and rolled on a separate chart.

More details became the calling card for how good your game was and

some people began to move on. What was a fun evening with friends

became a PHD study in game mechanics to just have fun. Increasing

complexity and rules also gave rise to the Munchkins and the Rules

Lawyer.

In addition computers became more common their graphics improved to

make video game playing more visually stimulating. Rpg's like Bard's

Tale and the Ultima series scratched an itch with RPG Gamers. The

Nintendo Entertainment system released and games like Zelda or Dragon

Warrior attracted RPG players as well as a whole new crown of

adventure seekers. These video games needed no dice, no friends,

just me and I can play anytime I want!

The Rise of cable TV in the 80's also begins to draw people away from

pen and paper gaming. Now 30 or more channels of movies, sports,

music videos and other oddities beckons for our time. The convenience

of video games, more TV entertainment options, combined with the

increasing complexity of the paper RPG games begins to take its toll.

In the early 90's the market crashes after a glut of product on the

market, increased competition from video game systems like Sega

Genesis, Super Nintendo, PC games and a new paint job on one of the

oldest forms of gaming hits the market playing cards: Magic the

Gathering.

No longer able to get four to six friends together at the same time

to play an RPG game, one needed to only find one other person to sit

down and play cards. The fantasy theme was a bonus for RPG players,

and while a bit complex-compared to RPGS the rules were easier to

read and teach. Additionally it was a familiar game format for most

Americans a deck of cards, and collecting packs like baseball cards.

With further slowing RPG sales from this new game sensation TSR came

close to dying as did the RPG market in general.

Card games too went through their cycle of rising in popularity,

copycat second generation games becoming more complex and too genre

specialized, then glutting the market and collapsing.

Really after Pokemon's decline in 2001 the TCG market became a shadow

of its former glory. A steady barrage of licensed based games hits

the market yearly and each dies after two to three years. Now Pokemon

Magic and Yugioh all the only core TCGs with any strength left.

Computer based MMORPGS have become the latest stake in the Paper RPG

heart while the internet, video on demand, 500+ cable channels,

Ipods and graphically stunning home video consoles all vie for our

free time. Gathering 4 people together for dinner once a week for

two hours is a minor victory, let alone for 4 hours to play a game of

imagination.

...and yet the paper RPG survives as yet another D&D revision is

released...

So where does that leave us? Speaking only for myself I am not sure

what the future will hold. D&D 4.0 in attempting to appeal to MMORPG

players went the wrong direction. The Failure of paper RPG's based

on licenses like DIablo, EverQuest, and World of Warcraft should have

been a warning to WotC. The success of mass market games like

Heroscape and even D&D miniatures should have signaled the direction

D&D needed to go: Simple, quick, playable. Instead the 3 tome

behemoth shambled forth into the sun light and did not seem to

impress anyone really. Rules munchkins love the crunchy 3.5 version,

and new players don't have a reason to quit playing a visual and

interactive on demand computer game.

But in that defeat lies an opportunity... to produce a simple and

quick to play RPG that can take advantage of the materials out there

like prepainted figs and heroscape terrain. I think a TFT variant

system is just the thing to succeed. I look at the great stuff Dark

City Games has produced!! Their free rules are only 7 pages and they

are great. Unfortunately I am unsure if they will truly ever produce

a complete rules book, and an 8 page primer is great if you know

RPG's already or only want to play their modules-but it isn't enough

to really be a next wave RPG system to bring new people in. As the

modules are all playable solitaire as choose your own adventure,

their model seems to feed into the solitary gamer more so than in

creating a new group of players.

That is the rub of the whole problem-new blood to play RPG's. There

are so many alternative forms of entertainment and most can be

enjoyed solitaire: video games, movies, tv, Internet etc. Getting

people to sit still for a 90 minute movie or a 1 hr TV show can be a

terrible challenge. Now getting them to commit 3+ hours to a game of

adventure? Uhm... probably not.

So how to fix it?

1) Someone needs to publish a simple rules lite complete RPG in about

48 pages. Basing it on a modified TFT rules idea while not becoming

over burdened in trying to depict realism (*cough* GURPS)

2) Sex up the gaming table with miniatures and terrain. Heroscape

set is cheap, and you can find loads of cast off D&D mins on the net

cheaply-make it visually appealing to play!

3) Use a simple adventure like the ones from Dark City Games to get

people's feet wet in Role Playing. The choices in the game are

simple (do you do this? or do that?) and the structure will give new

people a feel for what Role Playing is: an interactive story where

they make the decisions!

4) And then the don't list: Don't mock new players poor decisions,

don't share stories about your own game triumphs, don't get

frustrated or snippy when they don't understand or misplay the rules,

don't prod players into making right choices, and don't let anyone

playing not be actively involved in the story.

Not everyone will like playing, but most will have a really good time

and will ask when they can play again. Paper RPG's and the market

for them will never be what it once was-but it can still be very

good. They are a good excuse to spend some quality time together

with friends enjoying a story we all tell together and talk about ages

after. That's why I still take time to play.

-Fenway Brandon

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I think you make a good point.

Once RPG's got "big", people began demanding more "realism" and the

designers gave us enough realism to choke a horse. This realism

resulted in higher costs (due in part to greater development time)

and more pages of rules to learn. This had the effect of

exponentially increasing the "investment" one had to make in order to

start playing these games, investments in terms of $$$$ and time.

I really like Dark City Games' version of TFT. I hope they finish

their rules or at least put out a "basic" version of it if

development time on the complete rules set will take too long.

-Roland S Lee

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Brandon,

There is a lot of truth in what you have written. This reads as an analysis over a long period of time. One based on actual observation and real experience.

Will read again.

David Michael Grouchy II

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Yeah. Realism is one of those words. Hard to argue against. Not sure who asked for it in the first place. But watch out! Here they come! A whole bunch of people with solutions to problems we didn't know we had.

David Michael Grouchy II

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and IMPALED myself on it haha love it!

2Clips 5 of 5

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I have no idea what I just watched, but it was entertaining.

Gammelsmyg 4.8 of 5

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Funny, but wierd. I think i heard it before.

Anarki- 5 of 5

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Ha! This was suprizingly good! Even though the story doesn't seem to go anywhere, but I guess that's the point. I like the mix of in game footage and picture, but the best part was the narration style.

Whowho 3.5 of 5

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Well this is my first wow movies it was very interesting. The narration was excellent, with a little comedy thrown in but I will have to say that I give it 5 stars!! -Sandy

sandykync 5 of 5

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Oh yeah. I get it. And it only mildly helps that I know Robert Miles. The fantastic weirdness of our 13 year old minds eye creating such puerile story lines is *wonderful* to review through our mid-life-crisis years minds eye. Thanks for the memories. -Ricky

rcharlet

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Excellent narration! A wonderful glimpse into the byzantine world of pen & paper RPGs.

Lord_Inar 5 of 5

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